Moderator (MDR): MDR-Venkat

Guest-Speaker (SPK): SPK-Rick and SPK-Mark

MDR-Venkat: Hello everyone and welcome. Today's discussion, as you may have seen from the web page, is on JDBC (Java Database Connectivity). Our guests today are Rick Cattell and Mark Hapner. Both of them work in the JDBC group and are instrumental in the design and implementation of JDBC. We should be having Rick and Mark online any moment now. Rick Cattell is here. Welcome Rick.

SPK-Rick: Thanks.

MDR-Venkat: Rick, while we wait for our audience to send in some questions, do you want to give an update on what is currently happening in JDBC?

SPK-Rick: Mark and I are going to share this machine. I was saying that JDBC is being incorporated into JDK 1.1. We have also recently reorganized the JDBC web pages to give better pointers to the JDBC drivers available.

afeinman: Let me ask a general question then. Has anyone created a working frontend for their database using the JDBC? I haven't heard any success stories yet.

SPK-Rick: I'm not sure I understand the scope of your question. Here are two answers: There are lots of working JDBC drivers today; check the web pages. We have a number of them working in-house. Are you asking about all-Java drivers? There are only a few of those. It's a little early for major success stories by actual end-users, because the drivers are just coming out over the last couple months. We expect that the the biggest use of JDBC will not be on the Internet, but on Intranets. A number of large companies plan to use it, for example, for Java on the server in a three tier architecture. We expect smaller companies to use it for conventional client-server Java applications.

kwestby: What (if any) is the relationship between Jeeves and JDBC?

SPK-Rick: Jeeves facilitates building servers in Java. JDBC can be used in conjunction with Jeeves to build servers that access databases. The demo we presented at JavaOne used Jeeves+JDBC. Companies using a three-tier architecture, as I just mentioned, may use Jeeves+Java. It's also an easy way to make databases available on the net as HTML (as opposed to some kind of CGI script-based solution): you provide your company's server in Java using Jeeves and JDBC to produce HTML.

afeinman: I have a client (I am a consultant) who is looking for a way to have a variety of networked clients access a huge SQL database from differing platforms—it would seem that JDBC is perfect for this, but I'm having trouble pointing to anything to show him something to make him invest in it. Aside from the information available on the java.sun.com web pages, is there somewhere I can point him at?

SPK-Rick: We plan to add some JDBC success stories to our web pages as soon as we can. But in the meantime, your best bet is to follow some of the web page links to partners who have built and sold JDBC drivers. Visigenic, Intersolv, and WebLogic have customers using JDBC. IBM has released their DB2 JDBC driver today. There are a number of drivers available for Oracle, Sybase, and Informix. Our own internal MIS department is porting to JDBC and Java for many of Sun's internal applications. Product marketing for JDBC is Sharada.Achanta@eng.sun.com, she may be able to give you some specific success story contacts.

MDR-Venkat: Rick, you mentioned WebLogic.... I remember WebLogic was developing a comprehensive solution for database access before JDBC came out. What is happening to their technology?

Mark Hapner is here—welcome Mark.

SPK-Rick: Mark is online now, I'll let him handle a question....

SPK-Mark: WebLogic now has several JDBC-based products. Their primary product is a three-tiered solution with an all-Java JDBC driver.

afeinman: About security—does JDBC incorporate ways to encrypt the data being sent back and forth?

SPK-Mark: This is handled in the private protocol between the JDBC driver and database server.

SPK-Rick: The network protocol is generally already fixed by the DBMS server. So the JDBC driver doesn't get to choose it. If you're concerned about security on the Internet, a better solution may be a three-tier architecture as I was suggesting earlier; then the JDBC calls are only between the middle tier and your DBMS. Is the large customer you mentioned earlier concerned about using JDBC because it's new and unproven, or because of some technical concern?

drkuykendall: Do you know of any small java-native-net db servers for ~$99? I don't need a big fast database, I just need a database.

MDR-Venkat: Given we do not have too many people, perhaps it would be best if I made this an unmoderated room so everyone can participate directly. (Thanks to John Tang for the suggestion.)

Last moderator (me) signing off. The forum is now unmoderated. We can now talk directly.

SPK-Rick: There are a number of all-Java DBMSs coming out. Mark and I can't remember the web site addresses off the top of our heads. If what you want is an all-Java JDBC driver to a low-end DBMS, there are a number of options Mark is about to suggest. In this case, the DBMS is not all-Java, but it's in a separate process.

SPK-Mark: Symantec's dbAnywhere beta can be used with an evaluation copy of SQLAnywhere from Sybase. For a single user DB you might want to try MSQL which is available on the net. See our web page for MSQL JDBC drivers.

SPK-Rick: If you don't need SQL, then a very small and free DBMS is Object Design's ObjectStore for Java. It only allows a single user, and provides persistence for Java objects at a level beyond the Java serialization that JavaSoft has been working on.

MDR-Venkat: (Doesn't look like a chatty audience today :-) Are there any books on JDBC?

afeinman: (Answer to Rick's question above.) My customer is concerned about using unproven, beta software. I'm pretty comfortable with using it myself; I just have to convince him. ;-)

SPK-Rick: There's a book from the Coriolus Group in the bookstore today. Graham Hamilton and I have a book coming out with Maydene Fischer in a couple of months in the JavaSoft Press. Someone named Pratel has a book coming out in the same timeframe.

drkuykendall: I guess I want to focus on MY code and not on the database. I want to buy a product that loads like a web server. I add objects via a GUI. And it goes. I don't want to load Oracle for five days, another product to interface, and then have to babysit the whole pile. Anyone know of a product? P.S. Multi-user is required.

afeinman: You mean sort of like an intelligent SQL Form-maker?

drkuykendall: I don't know that one...

afeinman: Oracle's form-maker program.

SPK-Rick: I don't know of any multi user DBMSs that load themselves!

drkuykendall: Oracle databases cost too much to afford the extras.

SPK-Rick: The higher-end ($200?) version of the ObjectStore product is supposed to be multi user and load itself, and will probably support a JDBC driver since they have done so in the past.

MDR-Venkat: We have a new user who has joined just as we are trying to come to a close. Welcome, mcelwain.

mcelwain: Hello, all!

drkuykendall: I will look into ObjectStore....

SPK-Rick: ObjectStore's web address is www.odi.com; I believe their higher-end product is not out yet, but you can download their single-user one right now.

MDR-Venkat: It is almost 12:00 PM. Thanks a lot Rick and Mark for joining us here today.

MDR-Venkat: Thanks everyone. We had some technical problems today but I hope everything will run smoothly for the next session. See you all next week. Signing off....

afeinman: When is the next update to JDBC scheduled for?

SPK-Mark: We plan to put the JDBC 1.1 release out on the web in a few days. This contains some minor updates and will be the version that is coming in JDK 1.1.

SPK-Rick: JDBC 1.1 will also be part of JDK 1.1, as I mentioned earlier, but that's coming out later.

afeinman: Any news on when JDK 1.1 will be out? ;-)

SPK-Rick: JDK 1.1 Beta release date is not finalized, but will be out this year.

SPK-Rick: Bye! Enjoyed talking to you all!