Cheap G3, G4 Reader Feedback- 1 June 2000
Charles W.
Moore
Last week's column about cheap Power
Macs for G3 and G4 upgrading was the most popular Miscellaneous
Ramblings article Low End Mac has published, beating out my previous
champ -- a piece on the economics of processor upgrades. Apparently
upgrades are a popular topic. They also generate a lot of reader feedback:
From Eric French:Charles: Thank you for the article on upgrading a 6100 to a G3/G4. It
brings up many good points to those who wish to get a G3 or G4 "on
the cheap," and for many people it will work out fine. Unfortunately, I started down this same path with great
expectations in February of this year and was badly burned in the
process. I was getting rid of my PC and wanted a Mac again (we have
had several in the past), and thought that I could get into the world
of G3 computing for less than a grand. It worked, sort of. I paid: $99 for a 6100/66 (33 MHz bus!). The unit already had a 256k L2
cache chip, so this was an excellent deal. It also came with a 2X
CD-ROM. $299 for a Sonnet G3 266 MHz/1 MB backside cache (I believe
this card has dropped in price since I purchased it). [It has;
it's now $269. CM] $200 for a 4.5 GB 10 MB/sec SCSI HD. $66 for
two 32 MB SIMMs (64 MB + 8 MB on motherboard = 72 MB total). $40 for
Apple PDS 2 MB video card (new, Apple service part from an 8100). Your article states that PDS video card upgrades cannot be used
with the accelerator card. Not true. The Sonnet cards provide a pass
through specifically for this purpose. The 640k of shared RAM used
for onboard video is inadequate for pushing anything beyond 8-bit
color. $90 for Mac OS 9. $40 for a third-party new ADB keyboard. $20 for
a third-party new ADB mouse I kept the 17" monitor from my PC and managed to get a VGA to Mac
adapter for free from the shop where I picked up my 6100. Total
spent: about $850. I spent a little more than your example, but I
also acquired the newest Mac OS and a decent-sized HD in the
process. I did not run any benchmarks on my machine, but work with two Macs
regularly at my mother-in-law's business and home that I can provide
seat-of-the-pants comparisons to. Her machines are a Performa
6320 with a 13 GB 7200 RPM HD and 48 MB (120 MHz 603e) and an
iMac Rev. C, 266 MHz G3, 64 MB. I
found that my 6100/G3 was somewhere in between the two. With the PDS
video upgrade card, the video refresh rate was just slightly better
than the Performa, and far worse without it (even with the superior
processor). In all aspects, it ran slower than a Rev. C iMac for the
programs we like to run. I was unable to run Adobe Illustrator 8 without crashing, and was
unable to rip MP3s without dropouts and errors due to the low CD-ROM
speed (more money would have fixed this, but at this point my wife
was beginning to lose patience). I was forever unable to utilize USB
or FireWire (no PCI slots), forever unable to use cheap IDE hard
drives which transferred data faster than the narrow SCSI I was stuck
with. There were four main reasons behind the lackluster performance
compared to the Rev. C iMac 266. The G3 card in my 6100 did have a
larger backside cache than the iMac I was accustomed to using.
However, four things conspired to slow down the performance of this
chip. The first was, obviously, bus speed. Even with the 33 MHz bus
speed (compared to the 30 MHz in the 6100/60), it still is only half
of the iMac's at 66 MHz. Second was drive performance. The HD I
purchased was a good Seagate that spun at 5400 RPM (same as the
iMac), but only had a transfer rate of 10 MB/sec across the SCSI bus,
compared to 33 MB/sec in the iMac. Third is video performance. The 2 MB video card only carries one
third of the VRAM of the iMac and has no built-in modern 3D
acceleration support like the iMac's ATI chipset. Last is a
bottleneck often overlooked: RAM speed. 72-pin SIMMs only transmit at
~70ns latency. SO-DIMMS like those in the iMac run from 8-10ns. A
nanosecond may be a minuscule measurement of time, but with the
millions of instructions that the G3 is capable of processing, those
nanoseconds can add up over time. I guess for some the ability to use larger monitors, SCSI, and ADB
is worth the trouble, but in most performance aspects, the iMac has
it all over the upgraded 6100. I decided to cut my losses and sell the machine. Little did I know
how much that cutting would hurt. I set out asking $600 for the lot (including monitor), figuring a
loss of $250 would teach me a lesson. After two weeks of no bites, I
settled for $300 at a local used Mac shop. I don't even want to know
what they're going to try and sell it for. I am now typing this on a new G4/400.
Since the 6100 damn near cost me my marriage, I had to also purchase
an iBook for my wife to reclaim my
half of the bed. I guess this means that I don't qualify as "low end"
anymore =) . This is not to say purchasing an older Mac and upgrading it is not
for everyone. I know several people who have done so and have been
extremely happy with the results. I have helped them purchase and
assemble systems to their liking. I have also assisted others in
purchasing new Macs. It all depends on the individual's needs and
budget. I'm glad that you mention alternatives in your article (iMac,
etc.) It helps readers make an informed decision. One other option that perhaps you or Dan could write about are
Apple Refurbished units. Apple has excellent deals on several models
through the Apple store, all of which come with a 90-day full
warranty. The iBook we purchased was a refurbished Rev. A (32 MB of
RAM, 3.2 GB HD, etc.) Blueberry; it only cost us $1,200. Throw in a
64 MB SO-DIMM ($50), and for $1250 you have a great Apple portable
with 96 MB of RAM. We've had it for a month now and have had no
issues, other than dozens of stares and questions when I took it on a
cross-country flight last week. Thanks again for the article, and good luck with your 9500
project!! Eric French - Hi Eric;
Thanks for the interesting and very informative cautionary
tale.
Sorry to hear that the 6100 upgrade didn't work out for you.
I had heard that there was a workaround for the PDS slot issue,
but couldn't track it down in time for the article. My second
reference to slot shortage in the 6100 pertained to NuBus video
upgrades, which can't be used with the processor upgrade in the
lone NuBus slot.
From Gregory Larson:Mr. Moore, I read your article on the cheap Power Macs. I was impressed by
the amount of research you did to find all of those companies that
offer the older Macs at such a low price. I have an old 6100/60 that
works well. I've been going to upgrade that thing for two years now.
But when the iMacs came out, I decided to buy them instead of the
upgrades. And besides, I just use it to keep my company's books, and
it works OK for that. The other reason I am writing is that I am going to be in
Victoria, B.C. for a digital (Photoshop) class in July and would be
happy to get bring a computer up there for you. I don't know where
you live but we can ship it anywhere from Vancouver. Just a thought
if you can't live without one of those older machines. Greg Larson - Hi Mr. Larson;
I think you made a wise choice vis a vis getting the iMac instead
of upgrading the 6100.
Thank you so much for your kind offer of transporting a computer
into Canada for me.
However, as you've read above, I've ordered a UMAX S900 from
OWC.
I'm in Nova Scotia, BTW.
From Scott Atkinson:Your recent writing on older Macs (including the PowerBook column
of a few weeks back) hits the spot. Have you noticed that 8100s are
not part of the various refurb programs? I wonder why... Best Regards
Scott Atkinson - 8100s are darned hard to find is probably one reason, that is
-- relative to the prolific 6100 and 7100 series. The 8100 is a
nice machine, the best of the X100s, IMHO.
From Jerry Koszut:Hello Charles... Just wanted to take a moment to thank you for this article (and
all your previous ones). Excellent and thought provoking. I'm still using a Power Center Pro
210 I built for myself when I was Director of Corporate Support
for Power. It actually only clocks at 196 MHz (many of Powers
machines ran at well under their advertised rating), but it does have
256 MB of RAM and a 60 MHz bus, so I would assume it's a good
candidate for an upgrade similar to the one you mention in your
article. What, in your valued opinion, would be a good no fuss, no muss,
plug-n-play upgrade for this machine? I understand that some of these
upgrades are a bit wiggy, as a result I've been a bit hesitant about
performing this surgery. I do quite a bit of graphic design work so a
speed increase of any kind would be valuable. Thanks again for all your great articles. Jerry Koszut - Hi Jerry;
I think your Power Center Pro 210 would be a honey of a machine to
upgrade with that fast system bus (only 6 MHz less than this
WallStreet PowerBook I'm typing on), and your investment in
RAM.
I don't want to dis Newer, XLR8, Powerlogix , Met@box, and other
upgrade mfrs. and my hands-on experience with upgrading is
limited, so take that into account when weighing my opinion, but
IMHO the Sonnet upgrades are hard to argue with for price and
user-friendliness. No configuration hassles with switches,
jumpers, and control panels, and they tend to lead the charge on
price competitiveness.
On the other hand, while most processor upgrades use a
software/firmware patch for support, Newer Technology's upgrades
have a ROM chip that contains this data. The software approach
makes it necessary to keep your original processor card around so
the machine will boot to run the firmware updater again if the
code gets deleted somehow. The ROM chip is a more elegant
solution.
Here is the latest Sonnet price list for the cards that fit your
machine:
- Crescendo G3/PCI 333/512K - $199.95 (was $249.95)
- Crescendo G3/PCI 350/1M - $279.95 (was $299.95)
- Crescendo G3/PCI 400/1M - $349.95 (was $399.95)
- Crescendo G3/PCI 500/1M - $499.95 (was $599.95)
- Crescendo G4/PCI 350/1M - $399.95 (was $499.95)
- Crescendo G4/PCI 400/1M - $549.95 (was $649.95)
- Crescendo G4/PCI 450/1M - $649.95 (was $799.95)
- However, you may be able to do even better at places like
Other World Computing. For
example, they currently have a special on the discontinued Sonnet
Crescendo G3/300 MHz w/512k 2:1 Backside Cache (SG300C512) (For
the Power Mac 7300, 7500, 7600, 8500, 8600, 9500, 9600; WGS 7350,
8550, 9650; Power Computing PowerCenter, PowerCurve, PowerWave,
PowerTower; UMAX Super S900 and J700.) for $160.
From Bert CaoileI read your article "Cheap Power Macs: The $500 G3 and $750 G4" (a
link was posted at a Deal-Mac forum thread). It's amazing how cheaply
you can buy Mac computer parts and put together a pretty decent
machine, more upgradeable than an iMac, though not as pretty. I also purchased the BB 16 MB Umax
C600 from <http://www.smalldog.com>,
just to give you an idea how cheap you can get a decent Mac computer,
here is the cost break down: - $80 Umax C600 case/floppy/16 MB/256k cache/int
cables
- $20 Apple 4X CD-ROM from <http://www.compgeeks.com>
* note: you'll have to improvise mounting this internally, since I
can't find a source for the side "HD mounting sleds." I used two
screws through the horizontal slits. Email me if anyone knows
where to get these. - $35 Quantum 1.2 IDE drive from <http://www.pcliquidator.com/hdd.htm>
- $5!! (none left) Umax 240 MHz 603ev also from Small Dog (I
bought 2 but only 1 worked, next time I'll buy 10). At 240 MHz its
pretty spiffy and not too shabby.
- $9 for Umax mouse from Small Dog (Forrest said the Apple
design KB from CompUSA for $10)
So far that's $158 (+ shipping), just add $30 for a 14" apple
monitor or $80 for a 17" Apple MS from <http://www.pcliquidator.com/mac.htm>
and maybe even add 32 MB RAM $64 at <http://www.memoryx.com>. So for around $300 including shipping you get a pretty cool
upgradeable machine. Since the 240 MHz 603e is not available, why not
add a G3 card for another $180. Also Voodoo 3 PCI at ValueAmerica for
$80 after rebate (ends May 31st) -- but you'll need another 64 MB
DIMM to play UT. Bert Caoile
Virtu Design & Imaging Inc.
From Bruce Hoult:Hi, Just read your article on cheap Power Macs. While the 6100-based systems sound good, and I now wish I hadn't
sold my 6100AV so cheaply four years ago when I got the 8500, I think
that they are not the best machines to start from, and neither are
the 7100/8100. I recently picked up a PowerCurve with a 120 MHz PPC601, 56 MB
RAM, 4 GB hard disk, and 15" monitor for NZ$625 (US$280). I added a
$189 NewerTech G3/250 card from MacCPU (I see Bottom line has Sonnet
350 MHz card for that price now) and I've got something nearly
indistinguishable from my G3/266 PowerBook for well under $500. The PCI systems with the CPU on a card -- 7300/7500/... and clones
-- cost very little more than the 1st generation PowerMacs on the
used market but have much more and more current expansion (I put a
brand new "Fuse" PCI video grabber card in the PowerCurve with no
problems and Premier goes up to 20 times faster with the G3 than it
did with the 601, due no doubt to the L2 cache as much as the CPU)
and tend to already have all the bits that you'd have to spend extra
money on for a 6100 or 7100. It really, really pays to look for a used machine that already has
the RAM and disk etc. that you want. It tends to add *far* less (even
nothing) to the used price than having to buy the components
afterwards (even used). At the same time, mind you, you could build a nice Celeron 500
system with 128 MB RAM and a 10 GB disk for $500. I just this week
built myself a 700 MHz Athlon with 30 GB disk and all the works for
under $1,000 (for Linux development work). -- Bruce - Bruce:
Good point about getting the most HD and RAM as possible.
The Celeron is cheap, but it's still a Celeron. ;-) 
- <this article available in a printer-friendly
version>
Recent Miscellaneous RamblingsOther Recent Content on LEM- When to buy new, Dan Knight,
Mac Musings, 8/21. The publisher of Low End Mac admits that it
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surfing experience.
- Mac-N-DOS list. Yes, it's
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- New iMacs: Something for
everyone, Kel Taylor, Mac to the Future, 8/17. "...the iMac
has grown into a family, and a large one at that."
- Apple ditching G4, Anne
Onymus, 8/17. Apple embraces IBM and the G5, leaving Motorola
behind.
- New @ Low End
Mac: Receive email information on new links.
Biography- Charles Moore has
been a freelance journalist since 1987 -- and writing for Mac web
sites since May 1998. His The
Road Warrior column is a regular feature on MacOS
Daily, and he is a news editor and columnist at Applelinks.com.
Charles lives and works in Port Hilford, Nova Scotia, on the shore
of Indian Harbour Lake and in sight of the Atlantic Ocean. His
newspaper columns are syndicated across Canada, and he writes
regularly for several magazines, as well as doing Mac website
journalism. Charles has also contributed to MacToday magazine.
His current stable of Macs includes a Mac
Plus, an LC 520, a Power
Mac 9500, a PowerBook 5300,
and a PowerBook G3 Series
II/233.
Miscellaneous
Ramblings ©1999-2000 by Charles
Moore.
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Mac established April 7, 1997. This page,
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